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Buffy Sainte-Marie tells Rick Rubin there’s a reason she isn’t a household name in the U.S. A pioneering artist in the Greenwich Village folk scene, she could’ve been Bob Dylan, Joni Mitchell or Paul Simon. But in the early days of Vietnam when Buffy was singing protest songs about the casualties of war, she was blacklisted by the U.S. government. Her music was barely played on radio. But she still managed to find an audience with her classic songs, like “Universal Soldier,” which have been covered by Elvis Presley, Barbara Streisand, Courtney Love, Morrissey. She was the first Native woman to win an Academy Award. And even had a controversial stint on Sesame Street, teaching Big Bird about breastfeeding.

The Hosts

Rick Rubin

In addition to being a podcast host, Frederick Jay “Rick” Rubin is an American record producer and former co-president of Columbia Records. Along with Russell Simmons, he is the co-founder…

Malcolm Gladwell

Malcolm Gladwell is president and co-founder of Pushkin Industries. He is a journalist, a speaker, and the author of six New York Times bestsellers including The Tipping Point, Blink, Outliers,…

Justin Richmond

Justin Richmond is producer and co-host of the music podcast Broken Record with writer Malcolm Gladwell, New York Times editor Bruce Headlam, and music producer—and Def Jam co-founder—Rick Rubin. Justin…

Bruce Headlam

Bruce Headlam is one of the co-creators of the music podcast Broken Record. He worked at The New York Times for 19 years, including two years running the 50-person Video…